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um so what has worked for me and if I’m able to communicate that to others then

0:16

that it may help someone else um they may take just a small portion of it or they may take a large portion um but if

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someone can walk away from you know talking to me and hearing my story with

0:28

like okay wow he use this I didn’t think about it that way that that gives me you

0:33

know that gives me the motivation now that I have right now to to continue uh

0:39

to move in this direction this trajectory that I am on now although I don’t want to forget the pain and

0:45

suffering um because if I do you know I may lose that motivation that I have now

0:51

um and I hope I never do because that’s going to keep me on the right path

0:57

that’s going to keep me continue to help individual and at the end of the day it’s going to keep me you know sober and healthy all

1:04

right ladies and gentlemen welcome back to the podcast it’s your host JT today I’m honored to sit down with Ben Monette

1:12

I said that right right you did all right good how’s it going JT pretty good man I appreciate you taking the time to

1:17

do this first of all um I was introduced to you by by cydney and and Nick Lavery

1:25

yes so obviously when when Nick says hey you

1:30

got to talk to this guy he’s got he’s got a pretty amazing story than than I talk to that guy like I to hear that

1:35

story so uh you know I was thinking about this interview

1:40

today and really what what it means around habits right because uh just to

1:47

give a brief summary uh Ben is a former Green Beret has been literally the tip

1:53

of the spear in in uh for the past and when did you go when did you go in the army 2008 2008 and were you Special

2:02

Forces the entire time yeah so I did the uh x-ray program which enabled me after

2:08

basic training in Airborne uh to get a chance to attend Special Forces assessment

2:13

selection so when we talk about habits and we’re going to get into the the broad spectrum of of of habits and their

2:22

consequences to get into that program to complete that program everyone knows

2:27

that that requires uh some pretty sound habits to get you mental habits that

2:34

you’ve formed leading up to that up to that and then to get you through that process and then your time at War right

2:41

and then there’s the flip side you’ve you know I’m always interested I always say this I’m always interested to talking people that have lived on both

2:47

sides of the Habit Spectrum so when I say even the phrase a consequence a

2:53

habit what what’s the first thing that kind of comes to your mind oh man so I look at both both the

3:00

the positive habits or the healthy habits that I had just to get me to where in my career where I where I went

3:07

and then also the the negative aspects of it the unhealthy habits that I had and it was just like a a LoveHate

3:14

relationship that I I constantly battled and and you know the the good

3:21

often times overshadowed and the bad things that I was doing or the unhealthy

3:27

things I was doing uh so I didn’t necessarily think or believe to myself that um hey there’s a a serious serious

3:34

issue going on right now yeah and I mean I don’t want to spoil it but but I feel like it probably needs to be said now

3:41

there there’s a rock bottom that happens in what year for you oh man I would say

3:50

2023 was the The Rock Bottom there was there’s some times that I thought that I hit rock bottom but nowhere near you

3:56

know the the middle of 2023 okay so I don’t want to I don’t want to jump right into that I want to start off

4:03

one where this is a couple questions one where are you from where’d you grow up and then was was being a Green Beret

4:10

something that you like hey I’m I’m you always knew that this is this thing I was going to do yeah grew up in Dayton

4:17

Ohio went to Bowling Green State University in Northern Ohio on a

4:22

division one soccer schol college scholarship uh played there for three years and then transferred back home uh

4:31

and then finally ended up graduating from the University of Dayton with a communication management degree um I

4:37

knew of uh being a Green Beret I knew how important uh you know being the tip

4:42

of the spear was how much impact uh they had you know State side and abroad um so

4:49

it was always an option um but it didn’t really hit home until graduating uh

4:57

College working as a outside Sal representative and just kind of feeling stuck um I always wanted to do something

5:04

greater uh you know serve uh you know something better than myself or more

5:10

important than myself and it just happened that I one of the clients that I at the time was working with they’re

5:17

next to the recruiting station and I was like you know what this is this is an opportunity here so I walked in and you

5:25

know they were like hey you have a college degree you know there’s a there’s a x-ray program that you could you know try out or or see if you can

5:33

make to become a green Bray or you know you can go to officer candidate school

5:38

so I did some research some some serious reflection reflecting and then three weeks later I I was shipped off to basic

5:44

training so it was a really quick turnaround yeah and I never turned back I mean I just kept going and going and

5:51

you know kept you know accomplishing certain tasks and schools and and I

5:56

loved every minute of it but during that time I was was also uh hurting myself

6:01

mentally and physically as well yeah those I think one my next question was going to be uh so clearly you’re you’re

6:08

an athlete like you’re playing division one soccer that which is there’s a lot to be said about that not many people

6:14

show up for you know at recruiter do this x-ray program take the assessment

6:20

and then are shipped off in three weeks like that seems to me maybe I’m wrong but that seems like a pretty quick turnaround so clearly you’re in shape at

6:27

this point like you’re you’re training things but at the same time this is this is

6:33

always this is a part that fascinates me um it’s kind of ying and yang right like so you’ve got this these these positive

6:40

habits that that you’re are part of your kind of your upbringing right and then at the same time you’ve got this this

6:46

flip side what was that flip side for you and and how far back do you remember you know looking back on hey man that I

6:53

can that was a that was a a red flag oh man I’d say middle of of high school you

7:00

know I started hanging out with the older crowds started drinking to fit in and then it just become became a habit

7:07

right like I I was always successful I was always in shape you know constantly traveling for soccer you know and then

7:14

it just it moved into the military constantly traveling and and excelling

7:20

and but there was always that one thing right and that was always the the drinking to mask any way I felt right

7:26

like if there was something positive that went on oh hey I was drinking or something negative that went on you know

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I turned to drinking as well so it didn’t really matter what was going on in my life the the alcohol was still a

7:40

major part of it it’s GNA be confusing though at the same time right because you still you’re achieving all these

7:46

things and and I think we need to hear more stories about this because there’s a lot of people you grow up thinking

7:51

about somebody who might have a drinking problem you see what’s on TV and like the rails come off fairly quick but at

7:59

the there’s a lot of people man that are are they’re on both sides of the fence

8:06

like they’re still doing all these things they’re still achieving these things the consequences haven’t reached that negative side yet and it’s it’s

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much easier to justify I guess is the point that I’m trying to get to yeah I think it’s much easier to to turn the

8:19

other to turn away from it’s like oh well you know they looking back there were some things that happened to me

8:26

throughout you know college you know you know some disorderly conduct you know through you know some relationship

8:31

issues some some ways I handled certain situations where if I had the knowledge

8:37

now and reflect right I would have been like well yeah I have a a major problem here and it’s still a thing is like you

8:43

know I I I wish I knew what I knew now back then um but it’s just it was

8:50

just it was always like I always accomplished things so I didn’t really

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necessarily want to stop yeah I didn’t have that you know that Catalyst you know catalytic event that was like wow

9:05

you know my This Is My Rock Bottom I need to stop because the next day there’s something that positive went

9:11

on and that was maybe something I was just fooling myself or or the brains you

9:16

know you know Playing Tricks on yourself or saying Hey listen like you yeah you’re you’re you have an unhealthy

9:23

habit but look look what you’re doing so why change right yeah yeah and I’m sure

9:28

there’s enough people that are looking up to you right they they’re like there’s a lot of

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people that want to be you you they don’t they don’t know the dark side like they don’t know the things that you you

9:39

you you were suffering with with the bad habits but but at the same time there’s there’s enough people going man uh I

9:46

mean I don’t want to put words or thoughts in in your brain I’m just trying to think if I was in your shoes man it’s it almost fits the Persona

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right here I am I’m um dude I’m a Green Beret I’m a [ __ ] you know I yeah I

10:00

party but I also I work hard I party hard everything I do is is kind of to

10:05

the extreme where there were there people around

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you I’m G to say specifically once you’re in the army that were kind of

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looking at you like hey hey you might want to might want to look in the mirror on

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this no no to be honest with you there was there was not I mean I think we’re

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all like that where it’s a you know know zero to 100% And whatever I was doing it

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was 100% regardless of of you know the being healthy or unhealthy uh so as I

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was working out you know staying fit staying you know in tune to my my job in

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the advancements of of my career I was also you know traveling at 100 towards

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you know destruction yeah how did you get through those times

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because I I imagine like you’re going through the Q course like all of those during all those those periods and I’m

11:03

only asking you this because I’ve gone through training programs been through not at your level right but I’ve done

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things where where that dark side of you can’t come out right you can’t you can’t

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partake but yeah but boy you are looking forward to that that moment when you

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know you got the green light to to get back to the old ways absolutely and and

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maybe that was the the facade of of me thinking that I didn’t necessarily have have a a significant problem right is as

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I was able to put that down or internalize that that darkness in me uh

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and prioritize you know a school or a course or deployment um but it was

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always there it just maybe wouldn’t you know wasn’t escaped throughout you know drinking yeah but it was probably it was

11:51

definitely escaped through the negative selft talk the the the mental gymnastics that I was doing in my head constant

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wearing a mask mask right putting on a mask everything’s fine and then when I was able to you know let loose and you

12:06

know and go drink and do those things it just continued to get worse and worse

12:12

and spiral and get deeper and deeper and deeper yeah it’s it’s uh and even to

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hear you say that is is I don’t know if where it’s surprising is is right but

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but you know you hear somebody like you talking about a negative selft talk where from the outside which means

12:30

nothing right but from the outside most people go there’s no way this dude’s got negative selft talk like you don’t get to where you are unless you’re 100%

12:37

confident and I I think there’s a ton of power in hearing somebody say that because that’s reality right like

12:44

there’s this impostor Sy some of the the most talented people in the world still suffer with some type of negative talk

12:50

or impostor syndrome or something along those lines and it I think it’s hard to Fathom because everyone’s just too

12:56

worried they’re wrapped up in their own mind to even like there’s no way this person thinks like that it’s just clearly not possible yeah absolutely and

13:02

it was very you know it’s always sparked by me being very critical of myself right and I and I now when I’m you know

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talking with individuals and groups and whatnot I always say that that is a good

13:16

thing like you you you care enough to be very critical of yourself but at the end of the day you have to accept reality

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and you can’t you know go back and said man I could have done this better I should have done this because that’s

13:30

just going to open up another domain of of that negative talk that that hey I’m

13:35

not good enough and that was something that you know stayed with me you know

13:40

the entire career I was always looking at you know well I could have done this

13:45

better and that’s and that’s what makes you know Green Beret so great is because

13:51

we are you know very critical of ourselves because being critical enables growth and you know promotes excellence

13:59

but it does open that other door of well how do I cope with that how do I do I

14:04

have a community do I do I talk openly about it am I able to or do I just

14:10

internalize it do you think even being a Green Beret

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you know doing the most that you can do in in the Army

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uh was a I don’t know not a reflection but but a result of even some of that negative talk like because like you know

14:30

you almost prove it to yourself like if I can do this these things can’t be true right if I can continue to do this which

14:36

is like a you know it’s it’s a it’s a rat race you’ll never win at some point you know you’re just you’re

14:42

just spinning you know on a on a treadmill because you’re you’re never you’re never gonna get that true satisfaction of like actually liking the

14:49

person you are if you’re constantly you know trying to prove something even to yourself absolutely and that was one of

14:55

the things like whenever I would accomplish or go to a school or go to a training event it was never like being

15:03

in the moment and really like experiencing like oh wow I just accomplished this it was okay what’s

15:09

next you know I was always downplaying what was accomplished and always looking to the future of okay well I just did

15:17

this okay that’s over now what what now so I didn’t never I never really gave myself that time to to reflect and give

15:25

the the opportunity for me to be like okay I really accomplished this this was a a a significant you know hard event or

15:31

a hard training or school I should be giving myself Grace I should be you know proud of myself for doing that it was it

15:38

was just oh okay never mind you know similar to a lot of you know I’ve talked to a lot of friends and whenever you

15:45

know someone says you know I thank you for your service a lot of times you know veterans are like I don’t know how to

15:51

respond right I don’t I don’t know what to say and that was kind of how I I was

15:56

doing I was handling you know different schools and whatnot yeah I can see

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that and and how far I mean how far back do you remember feeling that way you know I mean like how far back do you

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remember just kind of I know second guessing or or just

16:14

that that that negative demon getting in there and telling you enough yeah I would say you know

16:22

during during the Q course the when the training portion of uh um of Special

16:28

Force um it was so fast I didn’t have the time to to have that to have that come up it

16:37

was always just you know compartmentalized it wouldn’t say till when I you know my first appointment was

16:43

in 2013 and coming back that was when I was

16:48

like okay like how do I reintegrate how do I now times are slowing down you know

16:55

what do I do what do I do with my thoughts what how how do I handle this um you know the transitioning between

17:02

being deployed and being always switched on and then coming home and be like okay

17:08

well this is all I know so I’m going to be you know constantly switched on and

17:13

it’s and it’s you know hurt my relationships with with my my you know my relationships with my with women and

17:20

my my wife and and whatnot because it was always constantly you know moving forward and constantly it’s like just

17:28

being the present slow down a little bit yeah being stagnant with a mindset like that it’s a dangerous thing right

17:36

like I mean there there’s tons of people that that struggle with silence right they they

17:41

struggle with if they’re not distracted I mean I’m I’m one of them like I constantly have to feel I have to work

17:47

on not doing something and I think I’ve always like I look back man I think I

17:52

was always that way like there always had to be something going on or because it’s it’s never easy just to to sit with

17:58

yourself and and clearly I mean as a society that’s gotten worse right like you can’t stand in line in a grocery

18:03

store without being glued to a phone and I honestly think like that’s may maybe not as extreme but but

18:09

it’s a form of it right um yeah it’s a we’re we’re comfortable in our chaos

18:16

right and and that’s and that’s why you know now I I do yoga and I try to to do

18:22

some mindfulness and and it’s it’s extremely difficult you know and you talk to individual like ourselves and

18:29

when we’re doing yoga or any you know mindfulness um exercises it’s like how

18:36

often do you have to catch yourself from go or wandering and bring yourself back bring yourself back constantly uh

18:43

because your brain is just always always thinking and always you know just trying

18:49

to identify and move forward or do something where it’s like just slow down

18:54

yeah and I struggle with that till this day it’s it’s everything everything it takes practice and and that’s probably

19:01

one of the harder things that I’ve started to do is is have that time where I just sit in silence know no phone with

19:09

me nothing is just sit and just relax yeah it’s difficult yeah it is difficult

19:16

right it seems like the simplest thing in the world but until you try it I mean it’s the reason that you you know

19:23

solitary confinement to punishment like it’s not you know it’s not easy so how many so how many times um did you

19:30

deployed uh eight times so eight times to the Middle East from anywhere from

19:36

being in the you know the desert with you know 12 guys to being at the B an

19:42

embassy wearing a suit and interacting with uh you know DC individuals and

19:47

organizations yeah all right so let’s let’s let’s get to where things start

19:55

going Ary here like what what were some of the first signs like hey my

20:00

consequences excuse me my habits are having some really negative consequences and I might I might want to I might want

20:06

to look at this thing yeah so I would say in say

20:14

200 20 2021 um I raised my hand I was like hey

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I I have a problem okay um yeah so I what got you to

20:24

that I was I was set up to go to a a specific course and you know I mentioned

20:31

earlier it’s like there were certain times in my career that I was I knew

20:36

that I wouldn’t be successful if I was drinking uh and that was that time that was a time so I was like I got to get

20:43

this under control I couldn’t do it by myself so I I raised my hand to the

20:48

command and you know was able to go to a 30-day treatment facility it was a kind

20:53

of aad I want stop I want to stop you there real quick because

20:59

that that must have been an incredibly difficult thing to do because one of the things especially I mean anyone in

21:06

uniform right but then you know take somebody as a Green Beret and to to have

21:12

the courage to admit that in the first place well that’s that’s uh it’s kind of

21:18

big man I don’t know if you felt it that way but but I yeah absolutely I weighed

21:23

on hey you know I need help um was there a chance that I wasn’t going to go to

21:29

this school if if I raised my hand yeah there was absolutely a chance was there a chance that I was going to pass that

21:35

school and be successful if I continue to drink absolutely not yeah um so I I weighed the the pros and cons and I was

21:42

like all right well you know I’m not going to be a soldier forever you know I’m going to be a a son a a father you

21:50

know a a brother and you know for the rest of my life and I need to get this

21:55

under control so yeah I I did it was welcome my command was like okay we’re

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going to get you the help and you know so the the 30-day program that I

22:08

went to it was it was in a a hospital setting it was 30 days so someone with

22:14

my you know unhealthy habits 30 days didn’t scratch the surface yeah um

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however I was able to stay sober uh for 18 months afterwards not by the tools

22:30

not by the community my spirituality uh but just by sheer determination and grit

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um the same that has gotten me to to where I’m at in my career um and I was

22:42

still although I was you know sober I was still life I was still handling life

22:48

stressors just not by drinking I was internalizing it it was getting you know

22:54

I wasn’t handling uh certain life stressor um in a healthy way and I knew I

23:02

couldn’t drink so what did I do I just I just felt it was more Angry more you

23:07

know it just I just couldn’t release that I couldn’t find a a way or or have

23:14

that skill set to you know handle life stressors without drinking because it was just 30 days and there you go you

23:22

kind of off to the racis figure it out yourself yeah it’s it’s like this itch

23:28

you just keep a scratch right like and you’ve got no Outlet like and that and that’s I I tell people that like no

23:35

matter what you’re doing that is self-medicating in whatever form right

23:40

it starts off as being fun you know in college it’s fun yeah um but but at some

23:46

point and your your your brain switches it goes from hey I’m just trying to have fun to I don’t want to I don’t want to

23:53

feel like [ __ ] or I don’t want to feel anxious or down or whatever it is is and

23:59

man there is no clear sign of when that happens but because it’s this gradual thing and

24:05

uh when it does it takes hold with it’s it’s it’s powerful right so absolutely

24:13

to not have that anymore is is makes somebody you know if you don’t give any other tools if you just take it away

24:18

that that’s a miserable person yeah and I was I was miserable it was you know I

24:24

was still successful at the at the course however you know looking back on it now I was

24:30

like man how much more could I have learned if I was able to to have a a

24:36

healthier Outlet all right a different habit where you know because life’s always going to to you know have speed

24:43

bumps some big and some some significant and if you have those those skills to to

24:48

handle it then you’re able to to handle in a a more productive way all right so you go 18 months

24:57

obviously yeah something happens um what kind of walk us through that yeah so I

25:03

was down in well 20121 I had a a complete uh right hip replacement so so

25:11

I had I had the hip surgery and initially it was fine um but about two

25:18

middle early 2023 just started flaring up some issues

25:25

um at the same time I I was able to say Hey you know maybe let’s try some

25:31

anti-depressants you know that might that might help me handle I know I’m sober now uh I’m not drinking but I’m

25:37

still miserable how am I how am I still miserable I took something that I I knew was making me miserable but I still am

25:44

so I started taking you know some anti-depressants and and that helped for a little bit but it it

25:52

wasn’t again it was just a Band-Aid so going through some pain and dealing with

25:58

some uh you know the anti-depressant and not not really working you know and uh

26:06

early um late or middle to early 2023 started self-medicating with some

26:13

CBD and Delta 8 at night time I was doing that which helped I stopped taking

26:19

my anti-depressants still against the rules right I was not allowed to do that

26:25

it was something that I made a poor decision although beneficial it was there was other outlets that I could

26:31

have explored but I chose it was my choice to to do that and then I had some some marital troubles

26:41

and you know one thing led to another that I I was flown home from a an event

26:47

and you know the the command had Reasonable Doubt to to give me a a your analysis test um so after that that was

26:55

the The Rock Bottom well so I thought right so I thought that was the rock bottom and uh so the next seven days I

27:04

ended up relapsing and you know it’s it’s crazy how quickly you can go right

27:10

back into that addiction it was it wasn’t like I it was like I didn’t drink for a day I went right back into it I

27:17

was actively trying to to kill myself drinking it was and it was it just came

27:22

back worse with the the the hatred for this myself you know the the why am I

27:28

doing this but that was the but once I started I just could not stop that’s and

27:34

that’s the you know the power it’s just very powerful the addiction is is a

27:40

disease and it’s it’s something that’s I almost can’t describe how powerful it is

27:46

in the brain um how that pathway is just generated it’s like that is the only thing that’s going to allow you to

27:53

survive well so I thought right um what cuz when you talking about

27:58

willpower right I mean you’d be you’d be hard pressed to find somebody with a career like yours

28:06

that has more willpower in certain aspects of their life and and I think that speaks to what you’re you’re saying

28:11

like the power how powerful this this thing you know had its grip on you yeah

28:17

you know you’ve gone you’ve gone through physical hell and you’re stuck with it but this is this is different right this

28:22

you can’t you can’t escape your own brain no and the 18 months

28:29

it was it’s you would have thought that that would have allowed me to to gain that willpower or to at least build up

28:35

some strength and resistance towards that and that second and and it wasn’t

28:40

like my relapse was that first time I I took a drink it was it was driving you

28:46

know to that to liquor store my brain already went down into relapse right

28:52

like before you take that first drink you have already relapsed in your brain your brain knows and has control over

28:59

your your actions and thoughts and it’s just you are going to make that happen and that was something that is it’s very

29:06

eye opening of how how much of a grip it has and and once you start right like I

29:12

mean when you even you telling me that story and you talk to anyone who quit

29:17

anything specifically around on alcohol and drugs when you first quit you have dreams about it like you you dream that

29:24

you re I I don’t know if you did I did I or I would dream I I I drank and I literally wake up in tears sometimes I

29:31

gotta turn this stupid thing I keep getting a little bubble thumbs up on yeah every time like you move your thumb

29:37

or something it it gives me a thumbs up yeah yeah well we’re gonna we got our producer gonna edit that part out but so

29:44

I don’t even know how to shut it off so that first morning when you woke up

29:51

after those 18 months had to be incredibly difficult and and to me it

29:58

almost makes sense why you just go back because it’s like you you want to get away from that

30:04

feeling like that feeling must have sucked there was a lot of guilt shame like what the 18 months was gone right

30:11

like that was that was the time that I had and I was very proud of that time of course um and then you know that how do

30:18

I how do I handle the guilt and shame of that well guess what I know what’s going to make me feel better is yeah to escape

30:25

to put that Band-Aid over it again and it just starts that vicious cycle and I

30:31

mean that’s a good point because people it seems so [ __ ] simple from the outside it’s like hey don’t do that yeah

30:37

hey just hey you know just here’s a good idea you don’t do that thing um right

30:43

right yeah you’re like oh yeah okay no I was wondering what the trick was thanks

30:48

for the great advice yeah but but to me it speaks

30:53

to where somebody is and how much pain they’re in I mean you just spoke like I

30:59

was trying to I was trying to drink myself to death did you did you know it at that point that’s what you’re were

31:05

doing no subconsciously you like the pain was just so bad that I’m I’m gonna

31:11

numb this until it’s really numb yeah I the the first drink I had it was I just

31:19

knew that I was right back into it it wasn’t you know and then I started to

31:25

lie to myself like oh no like I won’t go back to to the you know the the way I was well no I was right back into it and

31:32

it was something that you know looking back on and able to reflect you know that those seven days was extremely dark

31:41

and there said something to be said about each each time that you know you have some time of sobriety and then you

31:48

go back it gets worse and worse and worse um and it was it was it was just a

31:55

a bad time in my life you know I and then the you know the that comes

32:01

with the suicide ideations of like oh I’m back into this what do I do with my life you know and obviously alcohol is a

32:08

depressant so now I’m I’m depressed but I can’t stop drinking so I’m more

32:13

depressed yeah and then you know those those SI comes in and it’s like well

32:19

well that’s one option right like and I never really knew how to to think about

32:26

that and so after those seven days or probably on

32:33

the fifth day I was able to to get some help right I I you know reached out to a

32:39

couple individuals and and they brought me in front of you know our behavioral health

32:44

counselor and I’ll never forget this and it and it’s something I can joke about now but at that time I probably wasn’t

32:51

very enthusiastic about but you know I kind of told her you know where I was at you know mentally

32:58

and she’s like well don’t take this the wrong way but I have a perfect place for you to go and I kind of was like what is

33:05

that mean and she then then she said Treehouse recovery and again I’ve never heard of it and it just so happens that

33:13

uh two weeks prior to me sitting in front of uh you know that individual in the office some some Treehouse employees

33:20

came and talked to fifth group’s Behavioral Health so I was blessed that

33:26

they came and talked and I was the first person first active duty uh uh member to

33:33

attend and be a client at treehouse recovery yeah and I want to get into

33:38

that when when you told me about that place and and their methods I I’m thoroughly impressed

33:46

but but before we get to that um what were the ramifications how long did they take to

33:53

come down from from the Army yeah so everything thing was really put on hold

34:00

while I was in treatment okay so that that was you know I knew I had a you

34:07

know suspicion of what was going to happen to me um while I was in California um

34:14

however nothing was really you know put on paper until I returned in October of

34:19

last year okay and then what so what did that look like for you yeah so you know how I

34:27

mentioned like that I thought that was the Rock Bottom you know when I relapsed well so now you know I come back

34:35

and so I they revoked my special forces tab so I’m no longer on paper you know a

34:42

Green Beret I am getting chaptered out of the military and uh you know I have to start

34:50

a a new life after 16 years so I don’t NE I won’t get my my 20-year pension and

34:56

all those things you know coupled with you know going

35:01

through a divorce um losing my identity uh all

35:06

those things really happened within like a month time span holy [ __ ] man so you

35:12

think and that’s that’s me and now I can I mean I don’t laugh about it but I but

35:18

I I kind of chuckle to myself about well I thought the Rock Bottom was me coming

35:23

back and and doing that and that caused me to relapse and then I go through this with the proper tools right that that

35:30

Treehouse uh provided me and a community and you know the second you

35:37

know those those things happen and they’re like hey we’re going to take your you know your tab you know my first

35:43

response is you know that doesn’t discredit what I’ve done or what I’ve accomplished nor what I will accomplish

35:49

moving forward but I I reached out you know on the way home

35:55

I you know I called Nick I called a couple other people and was able to communicate and not internalize uh my

36:03

pain and struggles um and then secondly and I don’t know if if you’ve

36:10

thought about this but for the longest time during those 18 months I if I had an urge or a thought about drinking I

36:18

would instantly feel like a failure right I was like oh I’m right back at it

36:24

now like when those H when those instance happened like I was like yeah

36:29

okay I my brain is like oh I guess what I know what can help you you know go to

36:35

the bottle right but I understand it’s my choice now it’s it’s realizing and

36:40

identifying that you know I I created a this pathway in my brain that was so

36:46

strong through the the many years of of my addiction that of course my brain’s goingon to be like well hey I know I

36:53

know an easy fix yeah you don’t forget it no you don’t you you don’t forget it and you

37:01

know I’ve I mean I’ve been I’ve been sober five years I’ve talked to people I’ve been sober you know much much

37:07

longer and people ask me like hey do you do you still think about it man I’d be

37:12

lying if I if I mean I’m so I’m drinking a non-alcoholic beer right now right so

37:18

I have to go buy that somewhere and I pass things right and I and I and be

37:24

lying if I if I if I said I didn’t stop and and just see a label of something

37:31

right that that I was one of my regulars yeah and think what would that feel

37:38

like you know after the first one and and I’m not talking about the bad part

37:43

like I’m talking about like yeah the same reason that kept me going back like what that familiar

37:50

feeling um but you’re right it’s a choice like I’ve run the experiment man

37:56

I know what the outcome is yeah oh yeah I played that tape forward time and time again you know so at that

38:05

moment it’s a it it lasts usually about three seconds and then I and then I go on

38:11

about my life and and it was and it was harder I don’t know about you but but it was harder in the beginning and and but

38:18

like I’d be lying to myself if I ever said that would just go away and I’ve T you know I’ve been in in rooms and

38:23

meetings with people addicted to things and they’re they’re like they’re like cure right like ah even the thought of

38:29

it makes me I want to throw up and I’m like oh man I don’t I don’t have that cure no not at all like I can I can say

38:38

no but but man I don’t know I want whatever you got yeah yeah so it was

38:43

just a it was a it was a tough time however you know like you you we talked about earlier is about the the habits

38:50

right it’s like yeah okay well I now have new habits that I can I can lean on to um and and not use those unhealthy

38:58

habits that I that I use so frequently in the

39:04

past how much of [Music] you I don’t want to say felt like a

39:10

victim but at the same time we like look I got deployed eight [ __ ] times I’ve

39:16

given up huge portion of my life I’ve dedicated everything to this

39:23

and because I have this thing you’ve stripped something that I’ve

39:29

worked so hard for um and I’m not and I’m not saying that’s the way I think a

39:34

lot of people would feel that way and I’m not saying that you have because every time I’ve I’ve spoke to leading up

39:40

to this we we we’ve you know we’ve texted back and forth and we’ve SP on the phone you’ve always shown an amazing

39:46

um sense of gratitude to the direction you’re going now but but there had to be a part of

39:53

that uh at first where that that uh that flip side had I

39:59

mean Maybe I’m Wrong maybe you already had the tools and we we’re going to get into what Treehouse is doing but I don’t

40:04

know what was your experience with that uh again I’d be lying if I if I didn’t

40:09

say I did feel like a victim right like I initially I was like oh my gosh you know like I started thinking well I know

40:16

this person or this person did something worse than I did and all this stuff try like try to escape go you know but at

40:22

the end of the day it was my decision right it was my decision decision to do

40:28

that and you know moving forward if I if I expect you know accountability from from

40:35

others then I have to be accountable for myself and my actions and unfortunately

40:41

you know the my actions have caused you know these events to happen and I can’t

40:47

I can’t change that there are times that you know early on that I would you know wake up and think and ruminate about it

40:54

and like oh my gosh I can’t have that can’t happen and and you know get angry

41:00

at it and and try to cast blame to other people um but like it’s my choice today

41:07

to not drink it was my choice that day to to do that um

41:12

so it’s very humbling and it’s difficult

41:17

uh to accept that responsibility U because it had it a such a dramatic impact on you know my

41:25

life and it was it was my identity right 16 years is a long time to do you know

41:30

one thing but I I use some perception shifting there and I I think okay well

41:38

I’ve accomplished all these things you know 16 years you know 14 of which was

41:44

in heavy addiction okay so now this is the next life I’ve now what can I accomplish now

41:51

right like so I I try to change the perception of how I think about things nowadays because if you you are if you

41:57

get stuck in that victim mindset you know you’re you’re just going to spiral you’re going to you’re mentally going to

42:03

become more weak um and you know and I’m not going to say eventually I would have

42:10

broken if I would have stayed in that mindset but it would be leading towards that way yeah no 100% would like finding

42:18

Acceptance in that and then moving forward is and then

42:24

I think that that’s a great transition into into Treehouse because they’re clearly doing something right

42:32

uh when people are completely broken down and everything’s taken for them

42:38

from them and it’s something they’ve worked so insanely hard for uh it it takes some really amazing tools

42:45

to be able to move on from that and like I said yeah every time i’ you spoke it’s

42:51

like hey I’m looking forward to this part of my life I look forward to service it to other

42:57

and helping people which is which is amazing so let’s let’s break that down like I

43:04

mean what is that what does Treehouse mean to you and what was that process like for you when when you showed up

43:11

kind of a broken man yeah well first and foremost Treehouse has saved my life and

43:18

I can you know honestly sit here and say that I you know I don’t know where I

43:23

would be if I did not attend treehouse with the with the thing things that you know happened to me um you know in O

43:31

October till January of this year so yeah so I’m forever grateful for

43:37

Treehouse and I have the opportunity to to now represent Treehouse and

43:43

to to get the word out of the what resources they provide and how

43:50

they view addiction because I think AA is phenomenal I think

43:56

it’s it’s great it’s worked for millions of individuals and I and I I participate in it sometimes

44:04

and I know a lot of friends and I have a lot of friends that do participate that and that has continued to to you know

44:11

keep them on the recover the Journey of recovery but as our society is changing as we

44:20

are evolving into to to to different individuals than that you know the the

44:26

oldtimers we always say um yeah you know recovery has to change we have to adapt

44:32

we have to adapt to our to our societal needs and I think trius has done a phenomenal way of doing that um first

44:40

and foremost it’s it’s ran and owned by a veteran a Vietnam veteran um and they

44:47

focus on you know physical activity healing the brain they don’t necessarily

44:53

they don’t see you know addiction as an identifier right they they look at it

45:00

as it was a Band-Aid and what’s what’s the root cause of you using you know

45:07

whatever substance that individual is using yeah let’s tackle that let’s get to that part um and how they do that is

45:14

by phys by using physical act physical fitness um

45:20

so the way the way I like to explain it is you know we have two parts of our brain obviously the the main parts right

45:27

the limic system and the prefrontal cortex the limic system was my lifeline right it was the fight or flight you

45:34

know being deployed or being in any environment that that saved my life

45:39

numerous times uh but also you know ruined my life with the decisions that I

45:45

that I you know decided to make during stressful times in my life um and then you have the prefrontal cortex right is

45:51

that the reasoning portion of it it’s like hey remember you know you do decide

45:57

to drink after you know you losing your tab look what’s going to happen let’s play the tape forward let’s let’s take

46:04

some reasoning into this so it’s it’s working out to balance that to build up

46:09

the the prefrontal cortex so the way we do it is is Monday through Friday we

46:15

worked out and it wasn’t just some you know small workouts it was a a an hour

46:21

and a half of physical you know grueling exercise um and it was with a group of

46:28

individuals so we were constantly pushing each other um constantly trying to compete against one another in in a

46:35

healthy way and each time you know you would read that work out on the board like wow

46:42

you know like I don’t know if I can do that right and then you do that and then

46:47

you’re able to to sit there and reflect on it’s like wow I feel so much better

46:53

after completing this workout right like I got when I drank guess what my dopamine

47:00

spiked through the roof although it spiked you know equally downward right

47:05

so your body tries to get that homeostasis but for now when I work out I get that you know gradual rise of that

47:13

dopamine so I’m learning and I’m training my brain like hey look there’s other ways to to get that that feeling

47:21

not always just to to go towards the the substance yeah it’s easy I mean

47:26

literally I just had a conversation with a a retired Navy Chief yesterday I saying the same thing it’s

47:32

like somebody who’s addicted to cocaine he’s like I spent hours in an ice bath

47:37

in a sauna today going back and forth to get my dopamine levels

47:42

elevated where some guy’s gonna take one sniff of of cocaine and it’s GNA like

47:48

yeah you know but one ends terribly we

47:53

know we we know how one ends and and uh the other one is just timeconsuming

47:59

so why why do you think you never made that connection because clearly you were doing some hard ass workouts you know

48:05

prior to that and I asked myself this too like why why didn’t

48:11

we make those connections between physical activity to calm the brain and

48:17

to raise the dopamine because at the end for me that’s what what it was I was actually probably in better shape I was

48:22

drinking but it was just it like when you were done you feel feel your brain

48:28

just slows down right you just feel calm man I don’t think I was equipped

48:33

with the knowledge of it yeah right like that’s that’s one thing that trios does very well is not only do we go through these

48:41

exercises but we learn the reasons why we’re doing that right and then that that was like the light bulb in my head

48:48

it’s like man okay so I’m now I’m I’m experiencing this this feeling that I

48:53

probably always experienced after I get done working out but now I know why and

48:59

that why part part is so critical to to anything that we do so that that was

49:05

pretty enlightening um the the way we lived at treehouse was

49:14

something that you know having a reference of the the 30-day you know treatment facility I went to

49:20

previously we would live about a mile away from the facility so we would ride

49:26

our bikes to and from our we call it a team house right so being in the

49:32

military I knew full well you know living on top of guys and a team house

49:37

was something that was was normal to me but driving past the liquor stores to go

49:44

to treatment you know having those those weekends off that I could go down to the

49:50

beach go to the movies go on a bike ride passing you know bars and

49:55

whatnot eliminated the cultural shock that I that I felt when I got out of

50:01

that 30-day treatment facility that was in one section of a hospital right so

50:06

that’s something that was is significant is like we always had to have battle you

50:12

know battle buddies and and teammates with us but being in society and being

50:17

able to do things on the evening all while being in treatment was something

50:22

that was extremely beneficial to me I was able to

50:28

feel those uncomfortable feelings while still in treatment and

50:34

not when I’m off to my I’m off by myself for the first time in three

50:40

months so that was something that was it’s amazing that trios does that it

50:45

makes sense though you know you can talk about things all you

50:51

want but there’s there’s the experience the experience of you said I’ve got this

50:56

this needle’s worn it’s worn the same place in this record for a long time like I need to have the skills

51:03

to when when that needle wants to fall back into that that groove of having gone through that right just like a

51:10

stress inoculation of going through it and then trying to work work out those

51:15

those feelings accepting man I sure would like to do this but you know the juice isn’t worth the squeeze I’m going

51:20

to I got my battle buddy here and yeah what what else are they do in a

51:25

treehouse other than than I mean everyone everyone

51:31

coming out a treehouse it’s it’s like selection they come out in just amazing shape but but what what were the some of

51:36

the other aspects of yeah so I said I came out probably in the best physical

51:42

and mental shape of of my life right the physical aspect was was obviously there

51:47

through the working out and whatnot but the mental strength that I came out with

51:52

so each week I had two one-on-one therapy sessions so uh you know typical

51:59

treatment facility have maybe have one a week you know you’re you’re starting with you know an individual that may not

52:05

may or may not have that you know the understanding of addiction or The

52:10

credibility of going through it themselves right and I think that’s a a big key factor is is most if not all

52:18

individuals from uh trious recovery the employees or past clients so they they

52:24

know the pain they know the what the client is feeling at that time

52:30

and the same to go with the the counselors um so uh I worked through a lot of of my pts with um with my

52:38

counselors um so that was you know the one-on-one session a week and then

52:44

additionally we had this it’s called The Naked writing program and a and a Vietnam vet created it and it’s you know

52:52

you’d have assignments to do you know one of the ones that kind of stood out to me is I had to write a letter to uh

53:00

you know alcohol saying Hey listen this is how I feel towards you this is what

53:05

you know you you know this is the LoveHate relationship that I had with

53:10

you for so long um so we’ write it down and as our brains going you know a 100

53:17

miles a minute when we put pen to paper we tend to slow our brain down and able

53:22

to articulate a little bit more in depth of our feelings um and then we would read it to our counselor and then we

53:29

would go through it and how we felt during during the writing how we felt after um so those two uh sessions a week

53:37

um significantly helped me process you know not only the the trauma that I

53:43

experienced in the military uh the mental trauma that I’ve experienced throughout my life um and to to prepare

53:51

myself for what was to come you know I I knew that you know there was going to be

53:56

some administrative actions uh come down on what has happened so I was able to

54:02

process that and and better prepare myself for for what’s to come and they

54:08

and they helped and and it was really it wasn’t as strict as I as I used to is like well what do you what do you want

54:15

to work on do you want to work on you know you know your trauma in the military or do you want to work on you

54:21

know your trauma that you experienced you know mentally in your relationships

54:26

and it was it was a lot of a little bit of boat to be honest with you yeah and so that’s knowing the the the treatment

54:36

environment now having two sessions a week is was something that you know is

54:42

unheard of so that helped me mentally significantly um and then lastly we

54:47

would always do from 4: to 5:00 pm we would do a uh a peer group so it would

54:53

be a a peer-led group of of anything from you know issues that you’re having

54:59

at home with the family with significant others or issues that you’re having with

55:04

individuals at the house and that would really help you know being able to

55:11

identify and verbalize some uncomfortable topics and have you know those difficult conversations with

55:18

another individual that we often we we we always need to communicate to one

55:23

another but I was I never had practice doing that so having that practice doing that in a in a safe environment helped

55:31

me become uh more willing to to vocalize you know what what was going on and

55:41

mentally how do you may and it may be too early just tell me Shut up if it is

55:47

but how do you feel about the experience now you know again I don’t want to put words or thoughts in your mind a lot of

55:53

people when something like this happens it seems like the worst that could possibly happen to you

56:00

but like the stoic philosophy man or the quote what what stands in the way becomes a way right this

56:06

is a lot of times it’s these Crossroads in

56:12

life that it’s very hard to see in the moment but become our mission right and

56:18

our purpose what is your initial thoughts

56:23

now like when you think about the higher experience you know is

56:30

it how much weighs on on on you as a negative compared to a positive right

56:35

now oh I’m grateful that it happened and I say that and you may think like well

56:41

how am I grateful that you know you know all these bad things have happened well

56:47

it kind of brought me to this stage where I know

56:52

there’s significant amount of individuals that are struggling just the way you know I’m struggling or I

56:59

struggled um and now it’s I have an opportunity and I look at it as you know

57:07

I’m able to face adversity and then grow from it so what

57:13

has worked for me and if I’m able to communicate that to others then that it

57:20

may help someone else um they may take just a small portion of it or they may take a large portion um but if someone

57:27

can walk away from you know talking to me and hearing my story with like okay

57:32

wow he used this I didn’t think about it that way that that gives me you know

57:38

that gives me the motivation now that I have right now to to continue uh to move in this direction

57:45

this trajectory that I am on now uh although I don’t want to forget the

57:51

pain and suffering um because if I do you know I may lose that motivation that

57:57

I have now U and I hope I never do because that’s going to keep me on the

58:03

right path that’s going to keep me continue to help individuals and at the end of the day it’s going to keep me you

58:09

know sober and healthy yeah the ramifications

58:15

of uh going through what you’ve gone through doing the

58:21

work and there is something about about your your your history your

58:27

background um like I said it’s it’s it’s holding these two things it it you know

58:32

I wanted to start with that question of of you know what comes to mind when I say consequence to have it because

58:38

you’ve you’ve clearly done amazing things in the Army but but at the same time I mean where do you think you’d be

58:45

if that just train wreck didn’t happen like what what how would that you know

58:52

when you think about how would that played out think

58:58

I would have still been sober just miserable just miserable I I

59:03

think I would have been that drink yeah I was sober I would be sober but I would

59:09

play the victim I would be you know all these bad things are happening to me I don’t know you know how to handle you

59:16

know life stressors in a healthy way um I’m just going to internalize it and you

59:21

can only internalize it for so long until one thing breaks right and and it

59:27

may be your supry it may be you know anger it may be poor decisions you know

59:34

on a multitude multitude of different levels um but I know that if I did not

59:39

go through that I would not be sitting you know where I’m at

59:45

today comfortable in your skin yes and willing to to be vulnerable right is to

59:51

to accept what I’ve done but also to learn from my mistakes and and to identify the hey like I know I

1:00:02

have something that you know I could potentially help and if I can help just one person and that’s what we do here in

1:00:07

Nashville at the treehouse in the IOP program is you know we we have a good

1:00:14

amount of veterans but we also have a good amount of you know civilians and you know providing my experiences to

1:00:21

them and seeing these individuals grow uh from day one to coming into the to

1:00:27

the IOP until now you know month by month that’s the that’s the drive I have

1:00:33

now that’s the motivation that that continues to to keep me you know sober

1:00:38

and to continue to to help individuals Ben you you

1:00:44

said you know I may be able to help other people I think you can take the May out of it I know people listening to

1:00:52

this and I’m going to guess that people have already told you that that what you’ve done has already had an impact on

1:00:59

their life and we don’t know each other very well but just from your history I’m

1:01:06

going to guess that the same drive and motivation that allowed

1:01:13

you or enabled you to be a green bright and get to the the spots in the Army um

1:01:20

the positions you’re you’re in is you put that towards what you’re doing now and your your your impact is g

1:01:27

to be profound and I’m I’m excited to see where it goes man I mean it well I really appreciate that JT yeah it’s it’s

1:01:35

definitely you know it’s it’s something that’s a passion of mine now and and just like just to tailor the the same

1:01:41

motivation I had but just to a new thing right that I spoke earlier about perception shifting it’s is you know you

1:01:47

can I could sit there and feel bad about myself and and you know continue to just

1:01:54

live my life or I could take the same motivation that allow enabled me to become you know one of the population to

1:02:02

to now to to help individual so it’s just the the change and adapting to a

1:02:08

new lifestyle a new chapter in my life and I’m forever grateful for this

1:02:16

opportunity I love it man well listen if if people want to follow along uh I’m

1:02:22

with the cat out of the bag Ben and I been been speaking about him uh joining one of our speaking events with Nick

1:02:29

later uh in the year after this conversation I’m I’m G say that that’s

1:02:34

going to happen but if people want to follow they want to they they want to hear more from you that I mean are you

1:02:39

active how active are you on social media you know where are if people want to get in touch with you how are they do

1:02:45

yeah yeah so I’m on I just got back on Instagram so I I wasn’t on Instagram for

1:02:51

a long time just to the nature of the job um but so now I’m on so it’s been _

1:02:59

m777 um so you can follow me on there I’m on LinkedIn with Ben manette um and

1:03:05

then you know benm Treehouse Treehouse recovery.com is an email and again you

1:03:13

can Google Treehouse recovery we got know locations in Costa Mesa California

1:03:19

Portland Oregon uh Wilmington North Carolina and then Nashville Tennessee

1:03:25

and uh we have admissions line again we’re here to to help I’ve

1:03:30

Gotten you know I’ve seen employees drop their hat buy a plane ticket and fly to

1:03:37

an individual in need of help uh just to ensure that they get to to treos uh

1:03:42

safely um and that’s that right there is just the mentality of of trious as a

1:03:48

whole wow wow well I appreciate you taking the time man is there anything

1:03:54

else you you you want to make should we cover on here no I think that was that’s it JT I really again I really appreciate

1:04:01

it I follow I saw the the ice bath how challenge that was that seems pretty

1:04:07

cool I I I don’t do it as much I did it quite a bit I’d say three or four times

1:04:12

a week in California and that’s something that uh is amazing it’s it’s

1:04:19

painful at the time initially but just the way you feel afterwards is just I

1:04:24

mean you can’t you can’t describe describe it dude it’s to me it’s it’s a metaphor for like like so many things in

1:04:31

life you know what I mean like it’s like accepting this is going to stink for a short period of time but there’s

1:04:38

something on the other side of it right like there’s something bigger on the other side of it uh and to me I think

1:04:44

man that sums up about everything that’s good for us and that actually gives us purpose and makes us feel good about

1:04:50

ourselves um it’s accepting the uncomfortableness and still moving forward with it what I try to do is I

1:04:57

try now is when I get in an ice bath I try to solve a complex problem in my head or we we learn different languages

1:05:04

so I I go recite my bio and my my target language and what I’m doing is I’m

1:05:11

trying to train my brain to in a chaotic moment like my body’s has chaos my

1:05:17

brain’s saying oh get out of this cold cold ass tub but I’m able to calm it and

1:05:23

and problem solve and it just has those analogies in life when when life is

1:05:29

chaotic and you’re able to you know utilize that prefrontal cortex right and that reasoning behind it just I’m trying

1:05:36

to find different ways to strengthen that prefrontal cortex yeah that’s that’s hard man that whole figh ORF

1:05:42

flight kicks in and loop and and to be able to think I mean veterans listening

1:05:47

to this or First Responders I mean you hear the word vapor lock it’s it’s the real thing man people eyes get real big and and I don’t

1:05:54

even know where they go they go somewhere if you if you can if you can start solving stuff I mean it’s been as

1:06:00

simple as like hey tell me your name yeah and just to get people out of that kind of uh so so I get that man

1:06:07

well uh thanks again uh Ben for taking the time and thanks mostly for for for

1:06:13

being vulnerable man like like you said it’s in that vulnerability this thing that we don’t want to admit is is where

1:06:21

is where the help actually comes from because then people you know they hear it and then even if they don’t get it at

1:06:27

first you know people in clown you are not you uh believe me not you but but me

1:06:32

like you know like they said something like you’re still not drinking the same people that come up to you like how’d

1:06:38

you do it how’d you do it exactly so it’s that vulnerability that that lowers those barriers so cool man well thanks

1:06:45

again and I look forward to uh some some future conversations and then meeting you in person yeah absolutely JT thank

1:06:50

you you all right